Why use Github, why not use Savannah, others, or self-host?

I would suggest Gitea as it really don’t need much ressources. It is totally community-driven without google, etc.

Codebetg.org is a non-pofit org that host a public gitea. Many users already found it as a alternative plaform for their projects.

Sorry for correcting, but @fossdd means https://codeberg.org/. :grinning_face_with_smiling_eyes:

I guess the only things preventing F-Droid from moving to Codeberg are

  • No CI/CD and
  • Fewer users than GitLab.

Oh yeah of course. You’re right, the missing CI is the biggest issue. the GitLab CI does so much for us, rewriting this would require time. Plus write a CI. Also does GitLab offer to host “to-HTML-builded” files which will builded insidea CI job.

But maybe is the work worth. Codeberg and the community offer so muh more, also cause it is simply a non-profit.

23/03/2021, 17:10 por forum@f-droid.org:

1 Like

You are one of the most principled men that I think that I have ever met on a forum “justsomeguy.” I, too, get sick when logging on to that ole grubby, money-loving github, as I often find myself dashing to the little white thrown and have one heck of a good blow out. Peew weee.

This topic was automatically closed 60 days after the last reply. New replies are no longer allowed.

TL;DR: Yearly reminder - Do as I say, not as I do

Last year: Why use Github, why not use Savannah, others, or self-host?

F-Droid in essence says use free and open source software, particularly on Android. Am I wrong this is a subset of a general encouragement to use free and open source software as much as possible?

Proposal: Every app in F-Droid developed on Github, or on other non-free centralized “services”, should be tagged with non-free network services, or another anti-feature tag. These apps promote non-free network services - To file bugs or do any sort of development interaction, users must also use those non-free network services. The links appear in F-Droid app without any identification or warning, until tapped. IMO this is a bad thing.

This promotion of non-free network services is contrary to the purpose of F-Droid and should be highlighted. If the pervasive use of non-free development systems wasn’t already obvious to users, see here for some numbers: Statistics: Apps with summary/description by language at f-droid.org - #6 by linsui

Disclaimer: I feel I don’t understand the real reasons, tenets, or philosophy underpinnings of F-Droid. Or I understand the theory, but not the practical application and drawing of lines. Sometimes I want to try to advocate for using F-Droid to friends, associates or contacts, but there are huge stumbling blocks when trying to give a consistent story. Why should they use free and open source software on their devices, when developers use non-free software and services on theirs? People don’t like being told “do as I say, not as I do.”

I am aware the original developer of F-Droid previously developed proprietary games software for Windows, IIUC. Did they change philosophy, or what really led to promoting free and open source software, for Android?

Any forge (until p2p ones appear…work in progress since forever?) will by like this?

ALL apps will get this AF?

Which services are free?

Define free in this context?

/LE:

Is this meme that you are doing now? We Should Improve Society Somewhat | Know Your Meme

Also context: leave gitlab.com (#159) · Issues · F-Droid / admin · GitLab

Wikipedia sucks, but look here!

and Here!

How those answer my question exactly?

Should I stop interacting with your posts?

2 Likes

Hi, I develop Arcticons in my spare time.

I’m a designer and not really someone who’s good with code. Github provides (if you like it or not) the most user friendly tools (for beginners). So, that’s a really important part, not only for me, but also the contributors who need to use git for the first time (a lot of them are beginners too).

I’m not interested in self-hosting or other tools that make it so much more work for me to maintain, I just want an easy experience so I can stay focused on the app. :^)

5 Likes

Also, imagine being shamed for maintaining an open-source project on a site that not everyone likes. :unamused:

3 Likes

@Licaon_Kter

How those answer my question exactly?

See sections and columns showing which clients and servers are free.

@Donno

I’m not interested in self-hosting or other tools that make it so much more work for me to maintain, I just want an easy experience…

I understand, but if we all follow this logic, we would all use proprietary Apple or Google products.

being shamed for maintaining an open-source project on a site that not everyone likes.

It is for truth in labeling. It is to encourage change to using systems and methods more consistent with F-Droid values.

Oh, so Gitlab is free, case closed.

1 Like

case closed.

No.

For about 361 apps on gitlab. Edit: Assuming using “Gitlab FOSS”. Gitlab Enterprise is Proprietary, per wikipedia.
Usability sucks, but that is a different issue, as you linked above.

Many other apps are on non free systems, and should be tagged, starting with about 2986 on Microsoft github.

justsomeguy: the front end for Savannah has had one active developer for five years. If you can get people to help him with optimizing the user interface (including gitweb/cgit and other dependencies with their own upstreams) and translating it and its manuals, that would be nice for the project.

3 Likes

@k0tyk

get people to help him

I wish I knew how…

F-Droid is dependent on microsoft github, and should be tagged as such.

@sorenstoutner

Shoud that be considered an anti-feature?

Moved here from there: IMO, something should be done to encourage moving away from non-free, proprietary web dis-services for development. I am convinced there are so many apps on proprietary Github/lab, it would almost be pointless to tag them all. But, some way of distinguishing, for easy filtering, would be a good thing. Positive/Pro-tagging those apps on F/LOSS development services is something to consider.

F-Droid app particularly, because they should set the example, but remain on proprietary gitlab and depend on so many apps on proprietary github/lab… deserves the non-free net dependency tag, under current tagging.

1 Like

I am a pragmatist, so in these circumstances I am in favor of working with what we currently have as we strive towards perfection. I think tagging things that are suboptimal is a good start, because it indicates to people that the status quo is not desirable.

I say this as a developer who has made the decision to make whatever sacrifices necessary to host all the critical infrastructure that my project depends upon (code repository, website, issue tracker, forum, email server, etc.). I do use a few communication resources that I don’t host myself (Fosstodon account, F-Droid’s forum), but none of them are central to my projects, and if they all went away the projects would continue to function without them. So, I have some sense of how much effort is required to only use open source tooling and to insist on self-hosting on top of that. And I get why many developers do not do so.

Self-hosting is probably a step beyond what is ideal for all projects, but I think it isn’t unreasonable for open source projects to strive towards a situation where all the SaaS they depend on is free software.

2 Likes

pragmatist

I understand and empathize. As someone with idealist tendencies, I feel sometimes “the only winning move is not to play the game.” (War Games) If we can’t make android apps without sacrificing principles, maybe it is better to work on something else like apps for Linux phones, or ways to make android apps without sacrificing principles.

Regarding Android itself, Google is moving it in the wrong direction (it is becoming less free with each release). I have spent a bit of time pondering over when it will cross the line that it becomes unusable as my daily driver. We haven’t reached that point yet, but I think it will happen at some time down the road.